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Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 2:57 am
by eujin
So in the end a stupid-rule-penalty was the difference. Beautiful goal from Son, I enjoyed that but they looked absolutely shattered at the end. Match fitness not what it was back in 2002.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 3:55 am
by MipoFanatic
While I generally agree, he didn't need his right arm raised to use his body to get in the way of the ball. Blatant hand ball in my books. He'd need his left (lower) arm out for something to land on, but he could have tucked in his right arm, no?

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 3:56 am
by MipoFanatic
So if Germany beats Sweden today, and subsequently Mexico thumps Sweden and Korea thumps Germany on Wednesday... :smt117

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 10:00 pm
by eujin
MipoFanatic wrote:While I generally agree, he didn't need his right arm raised to use his body to get in the way of the ball. Blatant hand ball in my books. He'd need his left (lower) arm out for something to land on, but he could have tucked in his right arm, no?

He could have tucked it in, and I agree as the laws are currently interpreted it was a penalty. But I don't think he should have to tuck his arm in. Law 12 talks about deliberate handball. It's the interpretation that having your arm out is unnatural and therefore makes it deliberate that I disagree with. If he's jumping around like a jumping jack then clearly he's deliberately trying to gain an unfair advantage by waving his arms around. But putting your arm out for balance when going in to block the ball is just what people do. It's hard not to do it, just as it's hard to jump in the air without putting your arms out. Are we really supposed to believe that Jang Hyun-soo was thinking to himself "I'll put my arm out here because it might block the ball and give me an advantage"? Making it a "deliberate handball" is just stupid and we see time and again that it ends up deciding matches.

Last World Cup I was watching Arjen Robben throwing himself around in the penalty box and thinking that it's too easy to get penalties. This is where a lot of the diving comes from. Players are being distracted from the spirit of the game, which is trying to work the ball into the goal from open play, and instead looking to get free-kicks and penalties (and repeatedly in order to get those they need to throw themselves to the ground). We also have defenders trying to defend with their arms behind their backs. I know I sound like an American soccer-hater, but the laws need to be rewritten, especially now they have VAR and that is going to punish every last ridiculous instance of it.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 7:17 pm
by Rothesay Saint
Half way through now in terms of games and I reckon my predictions need a bit of a re-write.

1) Argentina to go down 2-0 at half time against Nigeria, only for Diego Maradona to jump out of the crowd, headbut Sampioli and take over as manager. Argentina win 3-2 and go on to the knock out stages to be beaten 6-1 by France.

2) France to make it all the way to the semi - final, continually looking like they are almost a good team before proving they aren't by losing to Croatia.

3) England also to make it to the semi-finals, before the Sun revealing Victory Parade Plans kick them out of their stride and they lose on penalties to Germany.

4) Brazil to get knocked out by Serbia in the group stage, only to be sensationally reinstated after Serbia declares war on Switzerland. Neymar gets suspended for the Quarter Final for dissent, Brazil has a collective melt down, lose 7-1 to Germany, and then also declare war on Switzerland.

5) On the eve of the Croatia v Germany final Modric is jailed. The Great Escape shenanigans ensue and he tunnels on to the pitch in time to score the winner in extra time.


To be fair in among all that nonsense, Neymar to pick up a suspension for the knock out stages looks nailed on.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2018 7:08 pm
by eujin
The last time we were relying on an already eliminated Peru not to roll over and give up a bunch of goal difference to a Southern Hemisphere team beginning with "A" with a well known attitude to fair play, this happened:
eujin wrote:Argentina vs Peru 1978: Argentina needed to win by four goals to make the final. They won 6-0 after Peru and especially their goalkeeper, Quiroga, had a shocker. Claims that the Argentian military dictatorship had paid off the Peruvians remain to this day. Quiroga was born in Argentina.

Now someone told me, and I haven't had time to check this, that every time Denmark play France in the group stage, the winner goes on to lift the title. Euros in 1984, 1992 and 2000 and World Cup in 1998.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:17 pm
by eujin
Things have been a bit low-key around here and I am deliberately keeping a low profile at work. But my local coffee shop subscribes to one of those left-wing newspapers (taz) that people with beards read and runs articles about how an interest in football isn't really compatible with progressive politics unless you are Socrates in Brazil. They have an article today by a sports lecturer at Edinburgh University, Lee Jung-Woo, about the role football plays in Korean society. I thought it was interesting enough to post here in my translation. The original in German is here if you can get past the pay wall.

taz wrote:taz: What significance does football have for South Korean society?
Lee Jung-Woo: Baseball is the most important sport in Korea. With football, it's mainly the national team that plays a role, the K-League was never very popular, although football is intimately linked with Korean society.

Would you agree with the idea that a national team always represents the society from which it emerges?
Yes, but not one to one. Three historical events have had a decisive influence on South Korean society: the time as a colony of Japan until 1945, then the war, and then the economic upswing. In the time of colonial oppression, which was very repressive and cruel, football was one of the few cultural fields in which a Korean identity could be preserved or even developed.

The games of Korean teams in Japan were a national event, even after the liberation. The sport produces the strongest anti-Japanese resentments in Korea. Before the first game after the occupation, which was in 1954, the former coach said: "We will win against Japan. If not, we will throw ourselves into the sea. "

At the same time, the military dictatorship tried to market itself inwardly and outwardly through the national team, for example through the Presidents Cup. There they invited as uncompetitive teams as possible in order to portray themselves as great winners.

It was about success at any price. The victories in football were supposed to illustrate the economic boom. And football was meant to have a calming effect on the population. As Korea developed, there were democratic mass protests in the 1980s, and even the introduction of the K-League in 1983 was intended as a distraction to keep the masses quiet through entertainment. That did not work, because there was a close relationship between big corporations and the football clubs; Hardly any club could develop a regional identity with its own fan culture. Therefore very few people are interested in the football clubs.

It seems to me that Korean footballers are bringing the least belligerent, least masculine physical culture to the World Cup. Their hair is colourful, no tribal tattoos are on display and so on.

The public image of South Korean footballers has changed significantly. Cha Bum-Kun, who is maybe still remembered in Germany, represented the old generation: the hard-working, reserved man of the post-war era. When football took off in South Korea in the late 1990s, players appeared differently: as pop stars. They had to market themselves and be more than just footballers.

There are now joint North and South Korean teams competing in the Asian Games or the Olympics. The KFA has rejected similar considerations, although in 1991 there was a joint team at the Junior World Championships.

Korean nationalism has two forms that are in competition with each other. On the one hand, there is a cross-border ethnic nationalism that is anti-imperialist in its treatment of the past. In sports, it is manifested in the fact that the team of the other country is also supported in international competitions. And then there is the patriotic nationalism of South Korea, which is economically based and rooted in pride in the economic boom of the South. This yearns for visible success. It ties in with the idea of ‚Äč‚Äčachievement, and this idea is incompatible with a political mission that unites players from both countries.

And what does Korean football have to do with the war, with the conflict between North and South?
Football is indirectly about war, and now sport is used symbolically as a means of reconciliation. There were several friendlies between the two nations, which were politically significant, in 1990 or even in 2005, when there were two friendlies in memory of the liberation, one with the men's teams and one with the women's teams. The South won the men's match, and the North won the women's.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 3:58 am
by Holyjoe
Make things difficult for themselves after the first two games, go in to the third knowing exactly what needs to happen in order to qualify, do exactly what is required but then find out the other result has not gone their way and they're out after all. A very typically Scottish way of exiting an international tournament.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 6:01 am
by RJB
Very impressed by Korea, given that they were eliminated (they surely knew what was happening in the SWE-MEX match). In fact, all the eliminated teams have really performed well, and that adds something to the tournament. Morocco, Peru, and Costa Rica showed very well - as did Korea.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 9:02 am
by MipoFanatic
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Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Thu Jun 28, 2018 9:02 am
by MipoFanatic
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Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2018 4:05 pm
by eujin
That was fun :D. I'm happy for the team and especially Son Heung-min who clearly enjoyed it. I heard that the players didn't know what was happening in the other match, which seems an odd thing to do, but maybe it helped them not give up entirely. Amazingly, Korea squandered a number of good opportunities in the last 20 minutes that ended up not costing them. The result did end up costing me quite a bit of money as I had to buy everyone at work a drink, but it was well worth it.

It was amazing at times to see Korea defending with the full-backs tucked into the area, but the closest Germany came to scoring was Mats Hummels's shoulder. Goalkeeper Jo Hyeon-woo has been the player of the tournament for Korea and it will be interesting to see how long he stays at Daegu now. I think it's fair to say that Manuel Neuer won't be playing left-wing again. Interesting also that with Ki Seong-yong on the bench Korea looked more solid defensively than in either of their other matches. Shin tried what Denmark tried against France and played a centre-back in front of the centre-backs and Jang Hyeon-soo has impressed me. Hwang Hee-chan didn't quite make his mark, but Son managed to get two goals and if you can beat the World Champions you can beat anyone.

Looking ahead to the Asian Cup in 2019, it will be tough now for them to keep their focus and address the things that need addressing. There are going to be matches in the UAE where Korea dominate possession and need to open teams up. Of the Asian teams that played at the World Cup, both Iran and Saudi managed to pick up wins (against North African sides) without looking very convincing, Australia defended solidly and have some young creative players coming through and Japan got out of the group - aided greatly by Colombia playing an entire match with ten men and already-eliminated Poland finding Volgograd too hot for running around. Not as disastrous for the AFC as 2014 though. Korea beat Germany, the World Champions and defending Confederations Cup holders. Highlight of the tournament.

Image

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:06 am
by OttoSilver
eujin wrote:I wonder who the Rothesay Unofficial World Champions are. Let's have a look...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unofficia ... mpionships



Only learned about this is a thing from this thread :P

Seems Croatia are the new title holders after winning the lottery of penalties.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 2:49 am
by eujin
Well I'm glad I'm not in the UK right now.

It's been almost 20 years since I lived in England, but seeing the explosion of hype and wagon jumping after wins against Panama and now Sweden is bringing it all back to me. I'm fresh out of proper teams to support now, I'm down to Belgium. Not a good sign if you're down to supporting Belgium, but then it reminded me of my first World Cup in 1986, although even then I started losing interest in the latter stages.

Re: World Cup 2018

Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 12:25 am
by MipoFanatic
No doubt our absentee board demagogue HolyJoe will be wearing a Croatia kit today!