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Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:24 pm
by kingkenny7
These days I am editing Wikipedia pages, but there are many documents are without citations/edited without neutral view. One of the worst thing is FC Seoul boys' original research in this area. I guess they want to be 'moving home away from Seoul' decision in 1996 was very oppressive decision from KFA and Korean government.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decentral ... n_K_League

But the funny thing is, K League said that back in 1996, all 3 Seoul clubs 'agreed' to move out from Seoul.

Image
K League 30th Annivesary. Seoul, South Korea: K League. 2013. p. 178. ISBN 9788996317845
(Red Box)"And 3 clubs in Seoul agreed to the decision,"

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:10 pm
by eujin
For some reason, reading this post reminded me of 독도는 우리 땅!

And sure enough, on the wikipedia talk page in reply to kingkenny there is written "Do you know Comfort women?" :roll:

Maybe they should just ban history books entirely in Korea for a generation and see how that works out for them.
:smt014 :smt013 :smt021 :smt019 :smt075

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 8:17 pm
by kingkenny7
eujin wrote:For some reason, reading this post reminded me of 독도는 우리 땅!

And sure enough, on the wikipedia talk page in reply to kingkenny there is written "Do you know Comfort women?" :roll:

Maybe they should just ban history books entirely in Korea for a generation and see how that works out for them. :smt014 :smt013 :smt021 :smt019 :smt075


It's so funny that the lad is trying to justify FC Seoul's "return" to the city and the decentralization policy was oppressive to them to move - The citation I put onto the talk page indicates "LG cheetahs regarding to move out of Seoul" from 1994. Also the 3 clubs in Seoul agreed to move out from Seoul in 1996, but after the agreement there are some turmoils. That's why they keep saying that it was an enforced policy by KFA and Korean government, ignoring that it was agreed in the first place.

https://ko.wikipedia.org/wiki/%EC%84%9C ... 5%EC%B1%85

If you read Korean Wikipedia "서울 연고 공동화 정책", it is even worse. Fucking novel they wrote on. Trying to put J.League's 'imaginary' Decentralization policy which didn't exist. The same guy made up the document but the page is deleted after a guy in Japan proved that the claims are false.

http://www.zirozebar.com/pedia-ko/w/ind ... d=15425091

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Mon Mar 13, 2017 10:49 pm
by OttoSilver
kingkenny7 wrote:But the funny thing is, K League said that back in 1996, all 3 Seoul clubs 'agreed' to move out from Seoul.


I notice even you put 'agreed' in quotations marks, which basically means they didn't agree but were indeed made to move.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 9:22 am
by kingkenny7
OttoSilver wrote:
kingkenny7 wrote:But the funny thing is, K League said that back in 1996, all 3 Seoul clubs 'agreed' to move out from Seoul.


I notice even you put 'agreed' in quotations marks, which basically means they didn't agree but were indeed made to move.


Please explain.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:52 pm
by OttoSilver
Which part?

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 7:30 pm
by daeguowl
kingkenny7 wrote:
OttoSilver wrote:
kingkenny7 wrote:But the funny thing is, K League said that back in 1996, all 3 Seoul clubs 'agreed' to move out from Seoul.


I notice even you put 'agreed' in quotations marks, which basically means they didn't agree but were indeed made to move.


Please explain.


It seems like you're using air quotations which would mean that you're being sarcastic when you say they agreed to move.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 7:56 pm
by SteveW
I assumed he was actually quoting rather than making sarky quotes there.

Let's face it whatever version you buy into the club remain cunts. Either they fucked over Anyang fans when they moved there and pretended to be settled when they intended to move back to Seoul all along or they fucked over Anyang when they saw an opportunity to capture the lazy fan base in Seoul and moved away.

Rangers esque levels of rewriting history won't change that.

Of course it's also fine to say you don't care about any of that and just support your local team.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 9:17 pm
by kingkenny7
SteveW wrote:I assumed he was actually quoting rather than making sarky quotes there.

Let's face it whatever version you buy into the club remain cunts. Either they fucked over Anyang fans when they moved there and pretended to be settled when they intended to move back to Seoul all along or they fucked over Anyang when they saw an opportunity to capture the lazy fan base in Seoul and moved away.

Rangers esque levels of rewriting history won't change that.

Of course it's also fine to say you don't care about any of that and just support your local team.


That is my point. No matter what they want to say they were kicked out or not, they will be hatred as they deceited the people in Anyang. What I can't stand is, they try to use Wikipedia as a part of their propaganda. K League 30th Anniversary book was written in 2013, and K League approved it as the official book. It says 3 clubs agreed. If it wasn't, these clubs should have made a comment about it but they didn't.
So the agreement was made and the 'enforcement' part came after. Simple as that.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Tue Mar 14, 2017 11:05 pm
by eujin
I thought it was E-Land that were trying to capture the lazy fan base in Seoul.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 12:25 am
by SteveW
Eland have captured the top lazy to even go to games fanbase. A less lucrative niche.

I'd be interested to know how many go to Eland games that aren't employed by the group. Single figures probably.

FC Seoul fanbase seems to be made up of quite a large number of hangers on and casual fans who will go to games sometimes if they have nothing better to do.

Even a lot of the foreign fans just drift there. A lot of their fans probably couldn't even tell you about their history and the club try to whitewash it.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 4:55 pm
by OttoSilver
Oh, the salt. This amuses us. :)

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 5:49 pm
by kingkenny7
OttoSilver wrote:Oh, the salt. This amuses us. :)


I think you misspellt scorn to salt. ;)

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Wed Mar 15, 2017 11:32 pm
by eujin
SteveW wrote:Eland have captured the top lazy to even go to games fanbase. A less lucrative niche.

I'd be interested to know how many go to Eland games that aren't employed by the group. Single figures probably.

FC Seoul fanbase seems to be made up of quite a large number of hangers on and casual fans who will go to games sometimes if they have nothing better to do.

Even a lot of the foreign fans just drift there. A lot of their fans probably couldn't even tell you about their history and the club try to whitewash it.

With your business hat on, you have to admit that "fast-food football" has been a very successful business model around the world. If the Korean market was ripe for a fan-owned or community-owned club to do well we would have seen it by now. When you see your potential customer base as coming not from hard-core fans of Ansan and Yongin, but people who discovered football at the 2002 World Cup or fans of Manchester United and Barcelona who need to get off the sofa and come to the stadium, the GS approach has not been without success.

If GS had done something different and just sold the Anyang team in order to set up a new team in Seoul, would things have gone differently for them than for E-Land or Seoul United or Bucheon FC? The World Cup stadium is arguably a better football venue than the Olympic Stadium, but an MBA student studying this couldn't claim that E-Land learnt all the lessons of GS and did it better. Back in 2004 if GS had done exactly what E-Land have done, they might well not be where they are today in terms of success and fan-base. I really hope it works out for E-Land and there's still time, but I wouldn't want to be the football fan on the management team who needs to keep going back to the board explaining why this is still a good project to pour money into.

Re: Korean Football on Wikipedia

Posted: Thu Mar 16, 2017 1:11 am
by daeguowl
SteveW wrote:FC Seoul fanbase seems to be made up of quite a large number of hangers on and casual fans who will go to games sometimes if they have nothing better to do.

Even a lot of the foreign fans just drift there. A lot of their fans probably couldn't even tell you about their history and the club try to whitewash it.


Unfortunately in this case you dont have the faintest idea what you are talking about. FC Seoul fans are split down the middle about whether the club dates to 1983 or 2004. There is lots of argument back and forth extolling the pros and cons of each point of view.

Regarding the move itself I think it's wrong to blame GS. It is well-establised that the KFA was looking for a tennant for Sangam. The two candidates appear to have been Anyang and Busan. Why not Suwon you ask? 1. Samsung HQ is in Suwon and they have always played there. 2. They'd just been gifted a brand new World Cup Stadium. LG on the other hand is not based in Anyang nor had they played there from the day the club was founded.
Although there is no proof I'm sure most, if not all, Kleague clubs at the time considered bidding to move to Sangam. Dont blame the club that actually did it.